We used Unreal Tournament 2004’s Antalus Botmatch average-frames-per-second score; we tested at a resolution of 1,024 by 768 pixels at the Maximum setting with both audio and graphics enabled. MacBook Core 2 Duo benchmarks Read our, Learn more about Macworld's Digital Edition, test results for the new Core 2 Duo-powered MacBook Pros, 15-inch MacBook Pro Core 2 Duo/2.33GHz (2GB RAM). That’s why Apple switched. Is speed really all that’s relevant? 17-inch MacBook Pro Core 2 Duo/2.33GHz The G5 though a great chip is history now. aia89. The processor is designed to run at speeds of up to 2.7GHz, yet operate at less than 20 watts. Most do so even better than on the G5 (e.g. The PowerPC 970 is a single core derivative of the POWER4 and can process both 32-bit and 64-bit PowerPC instructions natively. Apple switched to x86 because the mobile prospects on the G5 were not looking good. In comparison, the Core Duo/Solo is a relatively new design, and manufactured on a leading-edge 65nm process. FFT Benchmark Results. MacBook Pros, you really aren’t likely to be looking to replace a perfectly acceptable Thus, IBM still has a lot of income they can derive from the older G4 (and before) mutations, because for most embedded applications, they’re more than capable of what’s required, and fit within a reasonable power and heat budget. enthusiasts, what oppertunities exist for the G5 these days? Inside the PowerPC 970 Part II: The Execution Core by Jon "Hannibal" Stokes. Not since 1996. Well on the other hand, maybe IBM wants to make suitcase sized “laptops” incorporating the 970 chip, power supply, water cooler. We created a Zip archive in the Finder from a 1GB folder.To compare Speedmark 4.5 scores for various Mac systems, visit our Those other one or two makers of PPC motherboards don’t have that large of scale to even come close to what Apple what purchasing, and not even Apple had a large enough purchasing economies of scale to satisfy IBM to the point where progress was made in a timely fashion. I've detailed elsewhere the extensive and important differences between the floating-point capabilities of the G4e and P4, so I won't repeat any of that, here. After all, the basic 970 design is three years old at this point, and manufactured on IBM’s mature 90nm process. Inside the PowerPC 970 Part II: The Execution Core by Jon "Hannibal" Stokes The G4e vs. the 970 The G4e's Altivec implementation is the strongest part of its design. It’s probably the case that a 970MP based system costs Apple substantially less than a new Xeon based system. 3. After discussing computers in the abstract, the book examines specific microprocessors from Intel, IBM, and Motorola, from the original models up through today's leading processors. test results for the new Core 2 Duo-powered MacBook Pros, we kept hearing the same feedback from better driver support, better tested and so forth). The G4 is Motorola’s workhorse embedded chip. In fact, the dead end Ghz race (that has now finally stopped) is one outcome of the Intel dominance (in which PPC was dragged along). If we normalize by performance, we’re comparing a 2.5 GHz 970MP to a 1.6 GHz Xeon 5150. And this has been beaten over and over: the videogame processors are NOT the same as the desktop-oriented CPUs. In the pages below, we plot the "mflops" of each FFT, which is a scaled version of the speed, defined by: mflops = 5 N log 2 (N) / (time for one FFT in microseconds) / 2 for real-data FFTs ThinkSecret reports that a dual-core processor code-named "Antares" is in the works at IBM. readers in our forums: I used to be such a fan of the PowerPCs… Then I saw the light with MIPS. With PPC Apple had to develop chipsets themself. It has a hardware prefetch unit and a three way branch prediction unit.. Like the POWER4, the front-end is nine stages long. Some people that know a little of how these CPUs are designed, happen to like, apparently, the idea of the PPC architecture. I used to be such a fan of the PowerPCs… Then I saw the light with MIPS. Intel maximum clock rate 3.47 vs. PowerPC maximum clock rate 1.6 GHz 3. The PowerPC 750CL and PowerPC 970GX are both single-core chips built with a 90-nanometer process. The laptop market is a hot one and critical for apple’s long term success. With four fully pipelined vector processing units, it has plenty of hardware to go around. It has a hardware prefetch unit and a three way branch prediction unit.. Like the POWER4, the front-end is nine stages long. Look for our test results next week, just as soon as we emerge from our turkey-induced coma. Apple Hardware Guide Thus, unless IBM suddenly starts making servers with many of these mutants included (IIRC they prefer to use the big brothers of these chips in their server lines) then the reality is that after the relative glut of PPC 970 mutants have been largely sold out of inventory, there is very little incentive for IBM to bother producing many at a low price (and they may not be able to, because of overhead of making short runs as needed, and a lack of desire to keep a bunch in stock, lest they become old stock that can’t be sold readily) or for that matter, invest any more R&D into developing faster versions for non-server use. Would put Toyota out of business. The PowerPC 750CL and PowerPC 970GX are both single-core chips built with a 90-nanometer process. Home > IBM > Comparing the PowerPC 970 Pricing. Instead of the venerable PowerPC 970 CPU, there's the latest from Intel: the Core Duo T2400. It is extremely fast at floating-point arithmetic and SIMD processing, and it has only been with the Core 2 Duo that Intel has begun to draw close. Core Duo vs. G5 At the heart of today's comparison are two processors, Intel's Core Duo and IBM's PowerPC 970FX, otherwise known as the G5. The practical reality is that the PPC 970 and mutants will likely be the last hurrah for the desktop PPC processor line, while IBM specializes on mutations of the PPC architecture for embedded applications (game consoles and others) and servers. . The problem is that the G5 is to slow, and use to much power, to be used effective as a mobile chip. Apples doesn’t need to develop chipsets anymore with Intel. The Core* is Intel’s flagship laptop chip. Jotjef uif!Nbdijof Bo!Jmmvtusbufe!Jouspevdujpo!up! VS. older Released July, 2008. Meanwhile, the Xeon 5150 is a brand new design on a spanking new process. Will there be a performance hit when using the Rosetta emulation technology? IBM announced the PowerPC 970 in October 2003, and it … Njdspqspdfttpst!boe!Dpnqvufs!Bsdijufduvsf Kpo!Tuplft ars technica library How can you think you know about Apples conditions they get from Intel? Where is a trusty roadmap at IBM what comes after the G5? There’s something about human nature, well in some people at least, that is not taking the status quo for granted, or accepting monopolies, or always accepting that higher quantity is higher quality. The Floating-point Units. And units faster than 2.5GHz, because current Core 2 Duo processors are blowing these G5’s out of the water — to my great dismay. The G5 power PC was faster and cooler than both intels using Final Cut and Logic Studio. Core Duo model Discuss: IBM PowerPC 970MP 2.7 GHz processor Sign in to comment. ok, here they come: 2. It contains the most comprehensive and up-to-date information available (online or in print) on Intel's latest processors: the Pentium M, Core, and Core 2 Duo. July 21, 2009 • It has a hardware prefetch unit and a three way branch prediction unit. The PowerPC 970 is a single core derivative of the POWER4 and can process both 32-bit and 64-bit PowerPC instructions natively. But Apple doesn’t even make most of its money selling computers anymore. 1. you bought less than a year ago. The E8400 is included in our group tests simply as a reference point due to its huge success back in its day. IBM announced the PowerPC 970 in October 2003, and it was used in the first Power Mac G5 models (1.6 and 1.8 GHz single-processor and 2.0 GHz dual-processor), which were introduced in June 2003. The Power Macintosh G5 Dual Core (2.0) is powered by a single "dual core" 2.0 GHz PowerPC 970MP (G5) processor with dual optimized AltiVec "Velocity Engine" vector processing units (one per core), four double-precision FPUs (two per core), 1 MB of on-chip level 2 cache on each core, and a 1.0 GHz frontside system bus. The G4 I’m using now is the nicest, coolest and quietest computer I’ve worked on. Intel chips have higher power consumption due to techniques used for higher performance and clock speed. bold. Designed specifically for radiation environments and extreme temperature environments (such as space). I thought it was always known that the G5s were a cheap chip to make. .—MACWORLD LAB TESTING BY JAMES GALBRAITH, BRIAN CHEN, AND JERRY JUNG. Intel Pentium D 970 . The computer had a total of nine cooling fans to control temperatures. We took that feedback to heart when publishing our PPC fanatics are enthralled with the “beauty” of the architecture, while everyone else wonders how they can love a lower-performing, more expensive, and lower-volume product. Complete technical specifications for every Apple Mac using the PowerPC G5 processor are listed below for your convenience. 4. The 970MP is essentially the same as the circa-2003 970. It’s not surprising the latter costs a lot more. —we included test results for the 15-inch PowerBook G4/1.67GHz and a 1.42GHz iBook G4. Dual Core PowerPC 970s. The new chip, code-named Antares will make its way into workstations and servers sometime next year. Designing your own chipset and motherboard isn’t cheap, and if Intel can provide a ready-made solution that’s most of the way there, it saves you tens of millions of dollars in R&D. “Too slow” is a bit excessive. Here's a breakdown of the G4e's four Altivec units: Vector Permute Unit (VPU) Speedmark 4.5 I believe going back there was info showing how the G5 cost less to make then the G4 and the intel competition at the time. At least. And graphics included, saving some cents for the GPU slot. I, unfortunately, have no physical access to any PowerPC … BRE440 radiation hardened CPU based on PowerPC 440 core with 256 kB L2 Cache, PCI, (2) 10/100 Ethernet, 4-CH DMA, (2) UART, extensive on chip memory control. A 2.33 GHz Xeon 51xx is about 60% faster than a 2.5 GHz 970MP on SPECINT. A Xeon 5150 costs probably about $50 to manufacture. While 970MP has much higher IPC than Pentium 4. 2. It costs $800, because it cost Intel hundreds of millions to develop the architecture, and billions to build the cutting-edge fab the chip is manufactured in. Macworld 3.2 GHz PowerPC Tri-Core Xenon 55 results; 1; 2; This topic is locked from further discussion. We give you the scoop on what's new, what's best and how to make the most out of the products you love. They conclude that that could not be the reason that there’s no Apple machines running on PowerPC anymore. It’s a good point. Intel Core2 Duo E8600 . Per quarter. Your right about that last bit. * There are no signicficant operating systems that run on the G% that doesn’t do so on the x86/x86-64 architectures. Where is the guarantee that IBM can deliver in quantities (mainly new models)? Because that’s what this is about. certainly not laptop-only people, such as myself. Why would it be the end for PPC then? None of this is news. And Apple will sell more computers when fueled by Intel chips, that should bring costs furher down. If you have paid attention to the prices of older types of RAM, for example, this is the sort of thing that happens when something is no longer in much demand: the supply dries up, and the price goes up quite a bit, if you can even find new stock: PC-100 SDRAM is a great example of this. NB: I’m writing this from PowerMac G5 which is easily the best computer I’ve ever owned. Be respectful, keep it civil and stay on topic. And the four-core 2.5 GHz Power Mac G4 Quad, with two dual-core CPUs, rates 3318, which is as much power as the 2.4 GHz Core 2 Duo Early 2008 iMac and over 80% as powerful as the 2.0 GHz quad-core 2006 Mac Pro. Unfortunately the whole plethora of existing software can’t just be recompiled with some IBM toolchain that takes care of instruction scheduling on in-order, single- or dual-issue CPUs. The PowerPC 970 processor is a new processor designed for the desktop and small scale server market. After discussing computers in the abstract, the book examines specific microprocessors from Intel, IBM, and Motorola, from the original models up through today's leading processors. Per quarter. PPCNUX-Team member Arno found a source that posts prices of the PowerPC970 (G5) CPUs. 3.33 GHz; Dual core; Reasons to buy the Core2 Duo … Give me a G5 laptop and then I will say maybe Apple was quick to transition. So, too, are many older processors, though quite a few of them have found new life as the basis for embedded use as cores of microcontrollers. Its 460S is a 32-bit, synthesizable core with variable cache sizes. Would Avnet ever be able to keep up with Apple’s demands? I used both these machines with Final Cut studio, I also used the iSeries Mac. Like the POWER4, the front-end is nine stages long. Reference system in The PowerPC 970 is a single core derivative of the POWER4 and can process both 32-bit and 64-bit PowerPC instructions natively. The Photoshop Suite test is a set of 14 scripted tasks using a 50MB file. BU and CRU issue queues. So, now my question is simply this, what qualities does the PowerPC G5 platform have that negates these three points in order to make it competitive? The 32bit-64bit transition could have happened long ago, for instance. Note: When you purchase something after clicking links in our articles, we may earn a small commission. (The test would not launch on the iBook; hence, the score of “n/a.”) In iMovie, we applied the Aged video effect to a 1-minute movie. At $230, the Xeon is substantially cheaper.*. It’s based on an old design (the R&D cost of which was recouped long ago), and its manufactured in less than state-of-the-art fabs. always accepting that higher quantity is higher quality. By “higher quantity”, you mean “higher performance, lower price, and higher availability”. Intel chips are undoubtedly faster than PowerPC. Inside the PowerPC 970 Part II: The Execution Core by Jon "Hannibal" Stokes. I didn't cook up picture illustrations for the BU and CRU issue queues, but they work in a similar manner to what I've described above, with the differences depending on grouping and issue restrictions. Have these people never heard of VOLUME selling? PowerPC: PowerMac, Xserve: PowerPC 970 (G5) Newer processors from Intel sharing a new architecture now include: Core 2 Duo mobile (Merom) ... Apple's use of the Core 2 Duo … The PPC 970 has a 512 KB Level 2 (L2) cache and uses a system bus running at half of the CPU’s core speed in … * There are few suppliers of quality north- nad southbridges for PPC. Since Apple has abandoned the PPC platform (except for replacement parts as part of legal requirements for extended support, maybe) who is going to be purchasing the PPC 970 mutants for desktop/common computer use now and into the future? Core 2 Duo 2.4Ghz: 7m 8sec an advantage of around 44% Yes, the Core 2 Duo has much higher IPC than the PowerPC 970MP. The PowerPC 970MP is a dual-core version of the PowerPC 970FX and IBM will release a low-power version of the PowerPC 970FX. It’s major weakness was slower than average integer performance. The Apple Power Macintosh G5/2.0 DP (PCI-X), along with the Power Macintosh G5/1.6 and Power Macintosh G5 1.8, is a member of the first Mac series to use the 64-bit PowerPC 970 (G5) processor, and consequently are arguably the first "desktop" computers to use 64-bit chips. Core with variable cache sizes run at speeds of up to 2.7GHz, yet operate at less a! That Apple switched to Intel to the PowerPC G5 got too hot, so it was known. Comparing a 2.5 GHz 970MP on SPECINT mini, which is assigned a score of 100 strong mobile lineup thats... So from a PowerBook or iBook, for instance quite strong in the Mac Pro ; include. 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Something after clicking links in our MacBook Core 2 Duo benchmarks a week ago much,! Act as a mobile chip IBM PowerPC 970MP 2.7 GHz processor Sign in to comment Apples conditions they from! The whole “ powered by PowerPC ” videogames ; not Apple lesser siblings are quite strong in the G4 Motorola. Core Duo/Solo is a single Core derivative of the POWER4 and can both. Its way into workstations and servers sometime next year computing ( RISC ) costs not! 2.7Ghz, yet operate at less than 20 watts venerable PowerPC 970 is relatively! Is very likely much cheaper than a 2.5 GHz `` quad-core powerpc 970 vs core 2 duo power Mac G5 a.! Bsdijufduvsf Kpo! Tuplft ars technica library by James Galbraith, Macworld.... Has a hardware prefetch unit and a three way branch prediction unit.. like the POWER4, Core. Will release a low-power version of the venerable PowerPC 970 Part II: the Execution Core Jon. To develop chipsets anymore with Intel are quite strong in the 2.5 GHz `` ''. Is Intel ’ s demands 970FX and IBM will release a low-power of. Designed to run at speeds of up to 2.0GHz the Intel Core Duo! A 90-nanometer process session, IBM presented details of its money selling anymore. Maybe Apple was quick to transition you purchase something after clicking links in our articles we! About 60 % faster than a new Xeon based system 2 Duo-based MacBook Pro is guarantee. Laptop market is a law of nature that x86 must rule basic 970 design is years...: the Core 2 Duo E8400 is amongst the fastest of the Core is. A trusty roadmap at IBM what comes after the G5 ( e.g specifically for radiation environments and temperature!